tv BBC Newsnight WHUT October 23, 2010 7:00pm-7:30pm EDT
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paris saw cars set on fire and petrol shinseki on fire. the british people seemed to perk for speeches. why such a striking difference? as the rescue of 33 trapped miners have trapped chile for good. reflect on the future of the country. >> there is a desire in chile to overcome the divisions and wreckage of the past. >> the american civil rights activists jesse jackson asks why black men in great britain are mutts likely to be stopped and searched than white men. -- much more likely to be stopped and searched. >> in great britain and france trade unionists were on the streets protesting against plans for government cuts. there were very different affairs. in france, several days of
protests saw blockades and perhaps millions on the streets. in great britain, a few thousand union members joined a protest rally. also different cultures. >> across the length of france after a week of strikes and destruction, 1 million workers were on the streets marching against sarkozy's reforms. in great britain, 3000 turned out for a rally in london protesting david cameron's cutts. it is a different world. in paris, protesters blocked traffic. police fired tear gas at students who threw missiles. other places burned cars. thousands marched from the old
port chanting get your weapons. at the airport, hundreds of flights were canceled. one fit of the gas stations have been closed and trained stations have been closed. one leader sum up the mood of the militancy. >> the government refused to listen so we will paralyze the country. >> in contrast in london, the audience of public service workers were told they were facing unprecedented cuts and prepare for a political campaign. even union leaders except they are not mobilize like their comrades abroad. >> we are behind what is happening in france. you have to realize we live in the most draconian legislation in this world. unless they are going to -- we have to give the names of the people.
[unintelligible] that does not help and anywhere else in europe. -- that does not happen anywhere else. >> unions here weakened by the law but acknowledged they have to first win public support. you're saying what is happening is unfair and will get even more unfair, but how will you persuade the public? >> unfortunately, other than public sector workers ordinary men and women are being conned. it is the biggest con. it is the biggest con since margaret thatcher convinced us to sell our public utilities and buy them back. they will eventually rise up. >> there is much warnings of
chainsaws being taken to public services. this is a test of a generation of trade unionists. these are nothing compared to what is going on across the channel. polls show many french accept the need for the reform to raise the retirement age by two years, there is a paradox. 70% still report -- support these strikes. this correspondent notes the cuts are far deeper than those in france. he is puzzled by the absence of protests. >> the difficulty here is [unintelligible] in france, it is 2% in the same time. [unintelligible] it is unprecedented. far worse. >> france is a revolutionary
republic. the culture is different, but this man also says the media reflects different attitudes. >> what is interesting is the way the media covers it. it is all amount [unintelligible] and how difficult it is to go to work and how much problems strikes create. in france, it is all about they have a point, they have to be understanding. >> to explore those differences, jeremy -- from paris, the general secretary of the french food workers union. part of the trade union federation. >> why have so many mobilize themselves? >> there is a different political culture. on the level of train union membership is lower in france, but the level of public support
that is shown in the last week is often high. >> what is your analysis? >> my analysis first is we have had very successful massive demonstrations, but unfortunately this is happening because there is a lack of dialogue between the unions and government. obviously there is a difference between the u.k. and france. all this is going on because -- >> is it easier for people to take direct action in france? but here it the french government has made it more difficult to get on to strike, particularly with the
public transport. two years ago mr. sarkozy said [unintelligible] he has been proved wrong. know it is more difficult than it was in the past, -- >> you have a constitutional right to strike, haven't you? >> absolutely. >> you have to jump through quite a few hoops if you want to strike. is there steen and building up in the trade union movement? -- is there steam building up? >> i think there is. many people are only beginning to get a feeling of how grandees cuts will be -- how grim these cuts will be. this be reflected in disputes?
possibly yes, the government's intentions are the pay freeze and potential huge job cuts. talking about almost half a million in the public sector. that is without looking at the impact in the private sector. it worries about pension, all these could lead to difficult disputes. >> could we see scenes of the kinds we have seen in france? >> that i am not sure. we certainly could see major demonstrations. we are going to be organizing early next year a major demonstration, but we are very careful. it is too easy for us in the media in this country to be painted as the public enemy. too easy for us to be presented as we are against the wider community. if there are disputes that are causing difficulties, so our campaign is very much about
insuring that we build wider public support. >> it was a very interesting point by the french journalist. this spot on. in this country you get strikes that paralyzed the railroads and it is travelers misery. what are they reporting in france of that action? >> one thing that needs to be said is we have explained for months and opposition. time is so gradual we are getting more public opinion. in this precise case every person in france understands that person will have to look maugre -- will have to work longer. most people have disagreed with that.
>> you are a modest man, but would you like to give him any advice? >> i would like to have his advice to see how he [unintelligible] you have a much higher in the u.k., so we would prefer to get in on that. >> you should not be so ready to strike. >> i heard the point rafael made. one of the problems they face -- they face in france is a lack of dialogue with the government to really consider different approaches. certainly we are going into a difficult period, but i hope the government will be open to a dialogue. don't just go ahead and think they can make changes. >> it is more than a week since the rescue of 33 chilean miners
trapped underground for 69 days. soon afterwards and explosion in china left 37 dead. 12,000 miners killed around the world every year. a story of chile's miners is different. how much has this changed chile? we spoke to one activist. >> how come they survived all those days with hardly any rations, oxygen? the truth is because out of the mines, and most of them are sons or grandsons of nitrate workers, --they worked.
everything was by democratic election. everything was rationed off. i don't know if it will last or not, but let's pray it does. they will share all the profits that may come like they did down there in the dark. how they came out of the darkness is how they survived. that is the story of chile. [applause] [speaking spanish] >> many unknown people have worked forever who have lived anonymously in the darkness, and who had organized to create a beautiful country and which is this miracle. >> when the miners emerged one thing that was striking as
opposed to the button up british audience was to hear these men shouting chile. i cannot imagine this happening in this country. where does that nationalism come from? to put your country's name before anything else? >> there is a retired -- a desire to overcome the terrible divisions of the past. we have come out of a dictatorship or the country was divided in two. ♪ ♪ >> i think one of the ideas is the idea this as a nation comes together finally. the past is night caught -- not quite varied.
the age was 53-years old. this man's father was killed in 1973. then his stepfather was killed a few months later in that same desert. his bones were recovered only recently. here you have a child, he was 17-years old when he lost his father and stepfather in the military coup. these were disappeared people. think of the fact that these miners, we did not know if they were dead or alive. in some sense, you bring together the story of the old chile where political repression was everywhere. and. chile -- this new chile is
democratic. he said made this never happen again. >> this does not mean he was invoking the ghost of -- >> but he was saying this should never happen again, meaning you are the president, at it is your duty to make sure that the mining accidents don't happen in other accidents don't happen, that people do not disappear in the middle of the night. >> you had an uneasy relationship with chile. do you feel like the man who was -- the man who cheated death? >> yes, i do. i feel as if i cheated death many times over. i just happened to be fortunate enough to articulate this. i love the fact that the miners -- deep inside what happened to them during those days they
discovered something. it is very strange how when you are in the darkness, i prisonn or exile come up when you go through a trial, when death looks you in the face and does not take you a very strange thing happens to you. it happened to me when i returned to chile and was endangered several times. it changes you. i think these men have changed. ♪ ♪ >> i am hoping that chile has changed. >> the fact that this ended with victory, do you think that will mean -- do you think there will be less examination about what went wrong? >> i think there will be more.
the president hears the word -- there will be no impunity for the owners of the mind. that is a loaded word because it is de impunity the military has because they gave themselves a self amnesty. there will be no impunity there has been in the past. those responsible will pay. that is very important, meaning nobody is above the law. that will be a real miracle, if there was no impunity. >> if you are a young black man in great britain you are more likely to be stopped and searched them if you are white. the police say that has nothing to do with discrimination merely, a reflection of crime patterns. the american civil rights activist jesse jackson takes a
strongly differing feel -- strongly differing view. according to the most figgers come up more than 1 million searches are carried out -- according to the figures, more than 1 million searches are carried out in great britain. they concern is heightened by a plan to modify a stop and search power. these proposals would make it possible for officers to take account of a person's ethnic origin. black people are already 26 times more likely to be stopped than white people. jesse jackson joined jeremy and brian from the metropolitan police. >> this 3% of young people are black. are you saying 2% should be --
2% stopped should be? >> the racial dragnet is illegal. [unintelligible] racial profiling should be it stopped. >> that is a term not all of us are entirely familiar with. you are saying it is disproportionate. >>27 to 1 for blacks. bin laden would not have been stopped. the 9/11 billion swiss not have been stopped. people who are engaged in terrorism would not have been stopped. no one in the dragnet has been found guilty of terror.
>> there are slightly different powers on terror, but specifically looking at this question of stop and search. it does seem on the face of it i know a lot of young black men who are angry about this. can you justify it? >> i don't think i can. the difficulty is some police officers equate blackness with criminality. they get that picture from the fact that a half of all victims of street robberies say the person who attacked them is black even though it is a much smaller proportion who is black. you have a tiny proportion of black young men who are committing crime, but they commit a lot of crimes. if you search -- search somebody at random that young black men is more likely to be a victim of crime than they are to be a perpetrator. >> let me make another case,
that is to say when you use this broad search and seizure you deprive the police of moral authority and credibility. it is moral authority and being believable. >> if the police have intelligence there is a gan predominantly black or asian, a would be foolish to look for people who don't match the description. >> this has a lot to do with random stops and searches. when you are stopped that way [unintelligible] it could affect your credit score, access to jobs. your criminalize. blacks are about 31% of london, but 9% of the police department. you are supposed to have cameras
in cars. many of these cameras expose his behavior by police and its modifies their behavior. >> it has been tried before. to monitor whether prisoners are being fairly treated. for technical reasons, it has failed in the past. can i just comment on this section 60 advice? section 60 is all about trying to stop rival gangs equipping themselves with weapons. if you have information that you had two asian gangs who will fight each other, isn't it right police should be able to target asian people in that circumstance? >> asian gang bangers , here is dr. wang coming from the hospital and he is [unintelligible]
she is stopped because of her race. dragnet policing should not be happening to anybody. >> he is talking about intelligence-driven policing. >> that is different than random. if they are white or black, if it is intelligence-driven it is one thing. also, you have a population -- look at the policeman. a police force should look more like the people. >> we are still nowhere near that. >> we are not. unfortunately there is no political will to bring pressure on a senior police officers to do something about this. figures speak for themselves. it is difficult to prove an officer has been racist, but
when you look at where discretion is actually used and you see the disproportion malini, it si difficult to argue that some police officers are equating blackness with criminality, and nation with being terrorist. >> -- being asian with being terrorism. >> do you think police in some parts are still institutionally racist? >> i think individual officers when they go to the streets subconsciously or not equate blackness with criminality, equate being asian with being a terrorist. that is not right and something needs to be done. >> you are not saying the whole police force is institutionally racist, but some. >> it is not just police. the media projects blacks as less intelligent than we are, less hard-working.
the media sets a certain statement. look at bank profiling with who gets a loan. look at real estate profiling. look at access to oxford profiling. who gets the car dealership franchise. do not stop at the police. the structural inequalities are evident. from mortality to life expectancy. >> that is all for another week. goodbye. >> funding is made possible by the freeman foundation of new york and honolulu. newman's own foundation. the john d. macarthur foundation and the union bank.
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